[INTERVIEW] Being A Lawyer Brings Me Fulfillment – Samuel Agbeluyi, President CITN

The President, Chartered Institute of Taxation of Nigeria, Barrister Samuel Agbeluyi, tells BLESSING ENENAITE about his career, achievements and other issues

How would you describe your experience as the Vice President of Chartered Institute of Taxation of Nigeria and what were your achievements in this position?

I would describe my experience as rewarding, exciting and very educating. It was exciting because it was an opportunity and a big privilege to serve an institute like CITN. It was an opportunity to be a leader in an environment with very competent people by every standard. That helped me in doing what I have done in the past few years. I became the VP of CITN two years ago. Precisely June 1, 2021.

I need to expatiate on how the institute runs. One can bring one’s initiative and commitment to the office but it is not a singular role set up. I have been working under a president who is also a leader of about 28,000 members. It is not like there are no specific achievements for individuals. We have the president and others who have served. Whoever that is the VP is always the head of the committee which we call the Finance and General Purpose Committee. The essence of the committee is to look at the financial aspect of the institution, the risk associated with our (the institute) existence, and the likes. We are always keeping our eyes on the budget, revenue and to make sure the internal control system is working. There is harmony in the system and the VP is like the minister of internal affairs. We must stablise the system in a way that the president, who is like the minister of external affairs, is not disturbed so that he can concentrate on his activities as it has to do with stakeholders.

With my other members on that committee, we were able to move the institute from one level to the other. I don’t want to ascribe any achievement to myself but to the committee.

What were the lessons you learnt in that position that you would be adopting as the president of CITN?

In any human endeavour where we have various people from various backgrounds, one would be required to succeed. One must be a team player and do lots of listening. I got a lot of information and people give out information based on interest. One must be able to discern. That is key, otherwise one would make the wrong decision on a wrong premise that one would not know until it is late. One must be slow in action without necessarily rocking the boat. Also, I learnt that one cannot lord over anyone in an institute like this when everybody is enlightened. One is just fortunate to be the head at a particular level. If one is in such a position, one must be sensitive to one’s colleagues while one keeps one’s eyes on the overall goals. We know why we are here and we know what our founding fathers have done. So, there is a template. There are things to look at for that will be a guide.

What were the challenges you faced as the VP of CITN and how did you surmount them?

Nigeria experienced Covid-19 and it was a global issue. CITN also had a fair share of what the world experienced at that time. That affected us for quite some time. We were not operating at a full scale as we had to stagger the coming to the office. Some people had to work from home. Meanwhile, the expectations of our stakeholders remained constant. Ironically, that was when most members were down financially and otherwise.

Anytime anything came up, we had to stand up to the responsibility of the office. Many people lost businesses and opportunities. In that situation, one needed to show empathy (as a leader). Our main source of revenue as an institute is subscription from members. Then, how would we follow up our subscription collection from members who themselves were not doing well (financially)? Looking at the membership number, how would we know who was doing well and those not doing well? Anytime we were to send out a circular or memo requesting for obligation from members, we put it at the back of our mind that the system was not right, the time was quite difficult for people, and we had to carry people along.

Nobody, despite the challenges, was expected to drop the institute’s programmes. If one was expected to have a conference, one would have the conference. If one was supposed to have training, one would do that. Taxation is no longer a local affair, it has become international. We have new development and we had to make sure that Nigeria was not left behind. We had to do what was needed so that the institute was properly represented.

If I must access the whole team as led by the immediate past president, I think we rose to the occasion. We had a sizable number of our staff working from home. We reduced the working hours and the good thing was that we never owed anyone a dime. It was challenging to the leaders but we were able to surmount that area.

What are your aspirations in your new position and what plans have you made to ensure you succeed in office?

With all sense of modesty, no one becomes the president of the institute overnight. One must have started at various levels. I started my activities at the district level. I was a treasurer at the district level; a vice chairman and then chairman at Ikeja district, Lagos. It is a learning process and one starts with the layers of leadership. One has to learn a lot and build contacts across the country.

Coming from what I have known over the years and what I have been exposed to, it is important that at this point, in the new dispensation, we need to move the institution from one level to another. We have a great opportunity that a new government has just been sworn-in. The main challenge we faced happened to be revenue. It has been one of the challenges in the country.

We as an institute under my leadership will be focusing on that. The situation is not hopeless. We have to ensure that the challenge is overcome significantly. We will do that through a lot of training. One cannot give what one does not have. We are not like the politicians, with all due respect to them. Politicians talk about what they would do without giving details of how it would be achieved. There is always a process leading to any accomplishment. The politicians are not always ready to give us the process that would lead to that.

We have realised either as taxpayers, tax professionals or revenue collectors that without a proper or adequate knowledge, one cannot achieve a level of revenue collection. Asides training, we need to do a lot of advocacy for the taxpayer and the members of the public to carry out their obligations because tax is what we pay to live in a civilised environment. Look at developed economies, they were achieved through tax revenues.

The government cannot be asked to collect more debts. Hence, let us do what we need to do by paying what we need to pay to the government. Another side of the argument is that there is a trust deficit in the country. It is because of the evidence of what has happened in the past. Each day we wake up to listen to news, we hear about fraudulent activities everywhere. This has brought an issue between the leaders and the followers. The followers are not interested in paying their obligations. So, it is part of our job at CITN to engage in advocacy and to inform political office holders that they do not joke with tax revenue collection. When that is done, they build confidence in the minds of the people.

Once confidence is built in the minds of the people, they will become tax compliant. There is a call to enforcement although it is not the best way to go for the majority of the taxpayers. When they see sectors of the economy performing better, they will pay their taxes willingly. When they start doing state enforcement, the government will start losing the argument. Enforcement will be for those who are defiant while the confidence of the public has been gained by the government.

What influenced your decision to be a lawyer and what is its relationship with taxation?

I grew up liking lawyers and I wanted to be one but because of my background, it was not easy for me to attain it. I attended a polytechnic to study Accountancy as opposed to my first love, Law.

I went to a polytechnic because I did not see the possibility of going to the university because of the finance involved in it. I knew I could go to the polytechnic for two years, do attachment for one year, and refuel in terms of money, and sponsor myself for a Higher National Diploma. So, because of that challenge then, I had to go to Yaba College of Technology, Lagos, to study Accountancy. When I was to go to Yabatech, I had the opportunity to go to the Nigerian Defence Academy. As I was processing my admission in 1987, I knew that because of the regimented nature of the military, I was too highly opinionated to fit in. I had to counsel myself and dropped the idea of going to the NDA.

From Yabatech, I became a qualified chartered accountant with the Institute of Chartered Accountants of Nigeria. As I was doing my job as an accountant, I still had the urge to be a lawyer. It was that aspect of me that was not fulfilled until I became a lawyer. In 2006/2007, the opportunity to study Law at the University of Bradford, United Kingdom came, and I grabbed it with both hands. I graduated in 2010 and I returned to Nigeria very broke because I was a mature student with my family. I told myself I won’t go to Law school because I needed to carry out my responsibility to my family.

In 2011, I was admitted to the Nigerian Law School. It was a tough decision but I had to do it. Because I was a foreign student, I did a total of 18 months at the Law school in Abuja. I was called to the bar in 2012 and I felt fulfilled.

Because I have gone deep into finance, I have been balancing the two. It has helped me greatly because taxation is an offshoot of law. Taxation does not respect or listen to discretion. It is what the law says. If the law says company income tax is 30 percent, nobody has the right to make it 29 percent. So, every aspect of taxation is dictated by law. Taxation has a numeric aspect which is about calculation. Because of my background in finance, I can handle the numeric aspect. That has helped me in my tax practice. I see myself as more of a tax practice man even though I have a background in accounting, finance and law.

What are the roles and objectives of the CITN?

The principal role as stated in our Act is to set the level of standard required for whoever wants to practice as a tax professional. It aims to determine the standard of knowledge required to be a tax professional. That is the number one objective.

A fall out of that is what one sees us do from time to time. We have fellow members of the institute. To become a fellow member, one must have spent a minimum of five years in the institute. There are other conditions one must fulfill. Then, we have the associate members. We also have the student members. We have a large number of student members that we train periodically. I must state here that of all the professional institutes I belong to, CITN is the most dynamic. One of the wisdom of the Finance Act is that it is a way to correct the obsolete way of our tax law. Because of the dynamic nature of taxation, one needs a regular update. This is incorporated into the training of our students. We review our syllabus periodically to accommodate the new things in taxation. Another objective of CITN is research. There is some research that is usually conducted according to international standards.

Over the years, the government has encouraged the people to pay taxes. However, the people have often complained of not getting quality social amenities for the taxes they pay. What do you think is the solution to this?

The solution is transparency. The government needs to build trust among the people. Non-state actors, including louts, by virtue of their nature, collect these monies in a brutal way. Consequently, this practice is gaining ground and it is giving tax revenue a bad name. The government needs to move very quickly to work on this so that non-state actors can leave the state for the structured and law backing revenue agencies across the country to do their job.

When people talk of multiplicity of taxes across the country, the reason for this is essentially because of the taxes that non-state actors are collecting. The citizens cannot be left in a very helpless situation where bandits dictate whatever they must pay as tax before they go to their farms. In this case, the government is not protecting the weak within the system. The essence of government is to protect both the weak and the strong. Government must see to this so that the work of the lawful tax agencies will not be frustrated by these louts/bandits.

The government should also relate to the people the revenue they are collecting. This also connects to the lifestyle of our leaders. The opulence nature of our leaders needs to be tuned down. Some citizens are poor and do not know where their next meal will come from but we see our government officials going about with all manner of entourage. They are displaying affluence in the face of poverty. That is why the state of the nation is quite sensitive. I strongly recommend that government officials tone down the show of affluence in the presence of obvious poverty across the nation. This will enable the people to know that their leaders are genuinely interested in their affairs. Once this is done, the trust the people have for their leaders will be restored.

Nigerians are good people and one of the privileges I have enjoyed being at CITN is travelling across the country and I know Nigeria very well. Forget about the division the politicians are putting in our midst, we have very good people from every part of the country. Nigerians want to do the right thing. They are knowledgeable, sensible and they want to support the government.

Do you still practice as a lawyer?

My area of specialisation is property law and I will keep on doing that. I have been fortunate that the areas of professions I have chosen are what I can fit in any day. However, I rarely go to court for litigation cases.

Can you tell us about the toughest case you have ever handled as a lawyer?

I have had tough cases but there is what we call confidentiality of information as a lawyer. However, I had a case where a company required certain services. The security company (I liaised for) felt its interest was not properly served and we saw it. The essence was to get justice for this client and we got it.

What are your best moments as a lawyer?

My best moments have always been being able to see arguments from different perspectives. Law does that. Many people do not understand, that is why those who are not lawyers have certain reservations about lawyers who take up certain cases because they feel those cases should not be touched by lawyers. Of course, that is not how we were trained. When one picks a case, one looks at what the law says and one stands up for one’s client. Seeing cases from different angles is one of my best moments as a lawyer.

Between Accountancy and Law, which would you say is more challenging for you?

It will be difficult for me to say but I practiced Accounting for a longer period than Law. I think Law has activated certain attributes in me that I am grateful for.

Tell us about your family and educational background

I am married to a resilient lady from Benin, Edo State. I used the word resilient because we have gone through thick and thin together. I have always been on the road and she has always been on the home front taking care of our two children. They are doing very well. I am a believer in family because that is where one’s values come from. I am thankful to them for tolerating their father who is not always at home.

I am from a family of extremely honest and disciplined parents of blessed memory. If there is any element of honesty and discipline in me, look no further, I got them from my parents. My dad was fairly tough but he won’t disturb you if you do not disturb him. My mum was extremely mild. If you disturb her, she will move away. I am happy with my upbringing. I am from Imesi-ile, Osun State. It is a town I love so much. We believe in ‘omoluabi’. All those things in the Ten Commandments (in the Bible), we were trained with them. Although the values in the society are fast eroding, my family highly values them.

I am the last born of my parents and the only son. My mum was so fond of me that I did not start primary school until I was eight years old. I was a little bit of a rascal in secondary school but I was later calm. Afterwards, I came to Lagos from Osun State. After I completed my secondary school education at Christ Church Cathedral School, Broad Street, Lagos, I also passed my General Certificate of Education examination. Thereafter, I went to Yabatech, then to Lagos State University, and to Enugu State University of Technology Business School, Enugu, for my Master of Business Administration; then to the University of Bradford, UK. I have also done other professional programmes.

What would you say were the factors that brought you this far?

Without any iota of doubt, I would say it is God. Even if I want to be mild about certain attributes of myself, I will say I was a little bit stubborn. I had lots of friends growing up. Despite those things I and my friends did then, I still found favour in God and men. In addition, God gave me some things in abundance. One of the things that have also kept me this far is that I am a very determined person. If anyone dares me on anything and I believe in it, by the special grace of God, I will achieve it. Failure does not disturb me.

Asides being a fellow of CITN, you are also a fellow of the Institute of Chartered Accountants of Nigeria, and fellow of Chartered Institute of Stockbrokers. How did you achieve all these?

I will say it is determination. I was married when I did all these. I am a late starter in life. That is the reason I appreciate my wife.

What year did you get married and how did you meet your wife?

I met her at Yabatech. She was also a student in the Department of Business Administration. Like they say, the rest is history. We got married in 1998.

Who are your biggest cheerleaders?

They are everywhere. My nature is that whoever I meet, I try to look for their good attributes. Before Obafemi Awolowo (a nationalist and statesman) died, he was someone I was following. I read a lot of material about him, his books and speeches. I remember a speech Awolowo gave titled, ‘The Problem with Educated Nigerians.’ According to him, the problem is that they sleep too much. In that speech, he broke down 24 hours a day to eight hours. He said every adult must have eight hours of hardwork, another eight hours for recreation and self development, and the last eight hours for sleep and other things one wants to do. When I read that, something struck me. I started putting that into practice.

Also, I like (late businessman and politician) Moshood Abiola. He was cerebral. He was someone who had lots of those he has helped that worked against him. He was fond of forgiving those who offended him. I had a close relationship with him because I worked briefly with his wife also of blessed memory, Simbiat Abiola. I learnt a lot from him. He was a man of intellect and knowledge.

In addition, Bishop David Oyedepo (President of Living Faith Church worldwide, aka Winners Chapel) has greatly impacted my life. He puts an average of 18 hours a day into his work. Nobody does that and becomes poor. If one is not close to him, one would not know.

How do you balance work and family?

It is a tough one but the focus is that if I am at home or not, I can always be connected with my family. I do that a lot. It is a privilege to occupy certain positions. When one gives oneself for service, one should not give in to excuses. Anytime I have the opportunity to be at home, I utilise it very well so that my family knows that when I am not at home, it is also for their own interest.

What are your hobbies?

I love football. It is something that can arrest my attention. I like travelling although I have seen so much of that in recent times that sometimes I ask myself if I still like travelling. Also, I like to engage in any analysis. I want to see issues from different perspectives.

What is your favourite food?

My children and I have stressed my wife on the kind of food we like because we keep changing it. We used to like beans but in another season, we can say another food is our favourite. That has been my nature although I love boiled yam and egg sauce.

Culled from The PUNCH